The developer taking a multi-million-pound risk for Plymouth
The head of the firm revamping Plymouth’s derelict Civic Centre has vowed it will not be a “drive-by-shooting development” but will become a high-quality building his company will be custodians of for years to come. Tim Heatley, co-founder of Manchester-based Capital&Centric (C&C), said the reputation of his company depended on the successful rebirth of the Grade II listed skyscraper.
Mr Heatley, in an exclusive interview with PlymouthLive, said work to turn the former council offices into 144-flats and a campus for City College Plymouth, would begin this summer and could be completed within two years. He said that C&C would then manage and look after the building for years to come - but would make an initial loss on the “millions” of pounds it is planning to pump into the project.
The 14-storey building would contain high-quality, fully-furnished flats, plus amenities for residents including a “mini-cinema” and gym, Mr Heatley said. There could also be a cafe/bar on the roof which would be open to the public - but there would be no parking.
Last month, Plymouth City Council announced that C&C, a “social impact” property developer which specialises in transforming old buildings, had been given a 199-year “residential” headlease which includes the upper 11 storeys, plus land next to the Council House and part of its car park. City College Plymouth has an “education” lease for the bottom three floors with the aim of turning it into a Blue Green Skills Hub.
PlymouthLive has asked if C&C paid anything for the lease and is awaiting a response. In 2014, another Manchester developer, Urban Splash, paid a reported £1 for the building and sold it back to the council for £1 a decade later. A full planning application for the redevelopment of the building was submitted in March but Mr Heatley revealed the council and C&C had been working together for “well over a year” and said: “We have been working behind the scenes for a long time.”
And he stressed C&C’s tenure would be very different to that of Urban Splash’s. Here is how Mr Heatley responded to PlymouthLive’s questions:
WHAT’S THE LONG-TERM PLAN?
Mr Heatley stressed C&C had a solid track record of completing major developments, mostly in the north of England, and would not be passing the Civic Centre on to buy-to-let operators. “The way we go about repurposing buildings is consistent,” the 46-year-old said. “We have a reputation for taking on difficult and challenging projects
Eighty per cent of what we do is new build but we are well known for repurposing, restoring and conserving buildings. Plymouth City Council wanted a long-term custodian, with a track record. They did not want what we don’t do, which is flogging it off to random buy-to-let landlords
We have never sold a development to a buy-to-let landlord and never will. We only sell to owner-occupiers. We want the regenerative benefit of the project to be felt locally. If we sell to buy-to-let landlords it’s extracting wealth from the place.”
Mr Heatley said C&C was currently spending more than £3m a week on its live construction sites around the country and was keen to reassure people in Plymouth that the development would go ahead. “It’s in safe hands,” he insisted. “It’s vital for our reputation to do this and keep our track record.
We act quick, do things quickly and think long term. Our track record is evidence that it’s got the best chance it’s ever going to have.” He is aware that the Civic Centre divides opinion in the city - but said this is a good thing, being evidence people care about the building. “There are a lot of people that want to demolish it and others that are glad that someone will sort it out,” he said. “We are used to people having an opinion. If people don’t care about it, it’s not good for anybody.”
WHEN DOES WORK START AND WHEN WILL IT FINISH?
Mr Heatley said the revamp is imminent and told PlymouthLive: “Work starts in the next few weeks, during the summer.” And he added: “Eighteen months to two years from now is a good yardstick for completion. We are developing the ground floors for City College Plymouth and have been working with them for a year to see what they want and need. It will be done in a similar time.”
WHAT WILL BE IN THE BUILDING AND WHO WILL LIVE IN IT?
“It’s not student accommodation,” Mr Heatley stressed. “We have never done that and never will. We want the homes to be affordable to working people, not unaffordable or expensive.” He said the Civic Centre will contain “high-quality homes” which “celebrate the architecture and era of the building and create a great amenity”.
For residents there will be a “mini cinema space” which is “crazy comfortable with a big screen”. There will also be an exercise room, gym, lounge area and “spacious homes”, which are “beautifully furnished”. Mr Heatley said each flat will be fully furnished using furniture from a company called Hay, where “you can spend £3,000 to £4,000 on a sofa.”.
“We want the very best quality and it allows us to control the aesthetic throughout,” he said. But Plymouth people won’t be excluded and Mr Heatley said: “We can invite the public into the building, to a roof terrace, which will probably have a cafe/bar there, and get people to interact with it and enjoy it.”
And he said: “We do craft events, seasonal events, such as a Christmas gathering for residents in the public space, as well as for local people and businesses.” There are other benefits for residents too. Mr Heatley said: “If you rent with us you have access to all of our developments in the UK and can use the facilities, lots of gyms and lounges, and stay in a home as a guest.”
The flats will be managed by C&C’s rental company Ollo, and Mr Heatley said: “We are running the whole project ourselves. The homes will be for rent.
That’s important and we will be a good landlord - a custodian of the building for generations to come. There’s not a bad building or bad architecture, “ he added, “but there is bad management of a building if left or neglected. We have a track record and are the operator of the building.”
He said a range of people could end up living in the skyscraper, including families, but said: “Typically we get young professionals, in their early 20s, that’s the starting point, then a bit of a gap, we don’t have many with toddlers, but some stick around. Then a group between their late 30s and late 40s, or the LGBTQ+, that’s a demographic. And a lot of people in their 50s, 60s and 70-plus that love that our homes are well managed and have a concierge.”
But parking won’t be available, and made clear to those who rent a flat. Mr Heatley said:“We tend not to offer parking because the buildings don’t have it. It’s not for everyone, one in six or one in eight will say that unless it’s got parking it’s not for them, but that’s fine, it’s not for everyone.”
HOW MUCH IS IT COSTING AND WHO IS PAYING?
The Civic Centre project has already secured £18.4m from the Government’s housing quango Homes England with funding conditions requiring a housing developer with the knowledge and experience to deliver the new homes. The council is borrowing £17.366m to put towards the overall cost, put at nearly £50m,and Mr Heatley said his company will be injecting “millions of pounds” but isn’t expecting to see a return for many years.
“C&C will have to invest many millions in that project,” he told PlymouthLive. “We can’t leave it, it’s a liability we are acquiring. It has to be restored and will cost tens of millions of pounds to do that. We have acquired the building for whatever figure, but in doing so we are buying a contract that says we have to restore it to its former glory and spend tens of millions of pounds to do so or they take it back and charge us for the cost, or if we started work to put it back in the state we acquired it,” he explained.
“It’s a huge financial risk for our business, but we are used to that. The public sector has an asset that could be a financial black hole and needs our expertise.” He said the sums invested will include “a contribution of our own equity and, where appropriate, a loan.”
Last year, PlymouthLive revealed that the Civic Centre revamp could be loss making, and Mr Heatley now said: “The cost of the project is greater than the value at the end. When completed, if we were to sell it, the value would be a theoretical loss. A lot of our projects are like that, we spend money getting it right.”
But he said the project is vital to hike rental values and encourage other investment into the city centre. He said: “If we have done a good job, rents will improve in Plymouth and empty voids will reduce and we will get into a profitable space where our mortgage repayment is less than those of rental income.”
So it will eventually become profitable, “but it does take time”, he said, adding: “This is what we do and how it works and what we have done for a long time. We collaborate with local and central government a lot, it’s not a drive-by shooting development.”
AND WHAT IS NEXT?
“We want to do several projects in Plymouth and have to make this work,” Mr Heatley said. “We have focused on this for now but we are starting to think about what else we can do. We have a team and are open to ideas and suggestions for what we could do next.
That’s buildings and sites, typically all are homes, upwards of 150, it would need to be large. We are keen on this city.”
